I used to have lots of arguments on the internet with people including on this forum. What helped me stop was mindful meditation and reading Marcus Aurelius. He has this quote where he says: 'You always own the option of having no opinion. There is never any need to get worked up or to trouble your soul about things you can't control. These things are not asking to be judged by you. Leave them alone'. When I see something I disagree with I try to remind myself I always have the option of not sharing my opinion. Sometimes I share my opinion but my rule is no more than 2 rebuttals.
I don't think I have a porn addiction, I do engage in MO from time to time, but tbh porn was never that enticing , so it was never that difficult for me to distance myself from. For reasons I already stated in the thread. Regardless of that, the fact of the matter is that most of you here are aware that the points I brought about pornography are correct, and that most of you probably feel uncomfortable confronting that truth.
Do you even understand what radical feminism is ? What are its tenets ? Most of the males I came across here used the term "radical' to refer to some vague level of extremism, because they are parroting what they read on 4chan and are too lazy to do some quick google research.
I used the term "radical" because you used it to describe yourself. We can definitely agree that Reddit is a scourge upon the earth. Personally I'd rather be called a slur on 4chan than listen to the way they speak on Reddit.
The contention that all porn is rooted in misogyny is incorrect. Misogyny is not a universal aspect of porn. It has much to do with objectification and arousal than hatred for women. I'd say that what is universal about porn is objectification. Please don't assume that all men who consume crap hate women or are misogynistic. It is incorrect. Such assumption can even hamper your perception of men or potential life partner. There can also be men who doesn't consume crap but are misogynistic, controlling and toxic.
We describe ourselves as radical feminists, this is true. Yet you are still missing the point. The Term "radical" here means radix or root, not the meaning usually associated with extremism. Both are a scourge upon the earth. It isn't a matter of which is better, it's only a "chose your poison" situation.
A massive majority of it is rooted in misogyny to the point it outweighs any other representation where this feature isn't present. And like you stated, misogyny and depravity have increased and are still expected to increase. We are talking about patterns here, so far so good, the general patterns seem to support both observations. It has everything to do with hatred for women, just read the words of mainstream pornographers. Objectification is also one of the key facets woman-hating is vehiculated through in mainstream porn. I know it's a difficult topic for many males in general, but it is nonetheless the truth. Again, this is matter of confronting reality. Acknowledging the truth, no matter how hard it is, never sets you up for failure. The research done on this subject proves that misogyny is an casi universal feature of mainstream porn. And based on the demand and supply rule, it's only logical to conclude that porn wouldn't have been this way if it wasn't what the male consumer base felt inclined to support since the beginning. Of course the pornographers knew that all along. Misogyny resonates with male consumers for a reason.
If misogyny is the reason men consume porn, the only popular porn must be rape porn..or violent things like that right? Reports say that most searched for genre in 2022 is lesbian porn. https://earthweb.com/how-many-people-watch-porn/ Further, report says that Gangbang – 108% more popular with women compared to men Hardcore – 80% more popular with women compared to men Rough sex – 72% more popular with women compared to men And when it comes to the messages that you posted regarding pornographer's statement, I can also take various statements from various actresses saying they enjoy what they are doing. Yes there are elements of violence towards women, but it is unfair to conclude that most men consume porn to see women getting hurt. It is unfair to conclude that most men likes to see women in pain. Violent porn is a genre of porn. If most men were misogynistic, violence would be the top genre, as men are the ones that mainly consume porn. I don't support your view here. If I watch crap where a couple is enjoying sex, how can it be treated as misogyny? The reason I indulge in the crap is because my brain subconsciously believes I am copulating with that woman. It has to do with neurochemistry, attraction, arousal. Factors such as shock, taboo, or moral depravity has the effect of bringing in element of Novelty to the addict. Novelty can turn in anyway and can vary from crap where women are getting hurt to things where men are getting dominated by women. If all pornographers are misogynistic, the only stuff that must be streaming in porn sites are non-consensual violence. But that is not the case. Platforms like Onlyfans allow members to directly interact with consumers and from what I know, men drool over onlyfans to see women strip or do any crap like that. If men are misogynistic, they should be invested in acts involving women getting hurt, isn't it? But that is not the case so. If men are misogynistic, they would not watch women dancing or stripping. When a woman strips for a man and he faps to that, there is sexual attraction, objectification. I don't think that he is doing that out of hatred to women. If I hate you, why should I even ask you for a date?
I am quite skeptical about this. How would the porn sites know whether the watchers are male or female ? Because it's simply impossible to know whether someone is male or female based only on their public IP address or whatever analytics they might provide. Even more if these visitors use VPN while accessing these sites, which is exactly what the link you posted said. Even if they were relying on the registered accounts on their platforms, it would be impossible to know. Sounds like a big nothing burger to me as many aspects are obscured. As far as concrete reality is concerned, the porn consumer base is mostly male. And it's only fair to assume that it's the majority is going to shape the themes commercialized by pornographers. In the sense that the product will be tailored to appeal to their common perceptions. And until now, these tailored themes had been tilting more and more towards misogyny and depravity. While it's true that there are women who are addicted to porn and there are women who may consume female degradation, it doesn't mean that we can treat this minority demographic in both women and porn consumers as representative of women the same way we would treat the male consumers who truly represent the majority of males and the majority of porn consumers. The global themes are shaped by the majority of consumers, mainly men, and the global themes have reflected until now nothing more than a desire to degrade and subjugate women. If men have truly felt repulsed by these elements, as they should have, and reacted by avoiding porn the same way we usually do when we project ourselves into the woman being humiliated, pornography would have been drastically different from what it is today. Dude, you are not making any sense. I already explained my view quite well. Whether or not porn is reliant on misogyny and female degradation is unrelated to what kind of preference you may have, we are talking about global patterns here. This is something that yourself have admitted previously, so make it make sense.
@she_dernatinus I do agree that porn involving elements of violence towards women are on the rise. I disagree with your contention that men's arousal to crap is rooted in misogyny. We clearly have differences in opinion but we have a common goal of a society where sexual relationships are rooted in respect, understanding and love. Prost to that
Porn can be destructive even if it's not misogynistic, that's for sure. But because porn is a capitalist industry existing within phallocentric cultures where the concept of sex and male domination are conflated to some degree, it's inevitable that porn will be misogynistic.
I did when I said that porn can be destructive even if it's not misogynistic. But if we suppose that in some alternate universe where porn exists without the basis of woman-hating, the problems I or anyone would have with it cannot be addressed on a feminist ground.
If by misogynistic you mean the portrayals of women and the way sex is defined as a mean to humiliate them, then no that's not what misogyny in pornography can be summed to. Additional repulsive aspects such as human trafficking are also part of what makes the whole industry a real hotspot for propagating and normalising female degradation. You seem to think that misogyny, human trafficking, and child pornography are separate issues, while I think they aren't.
The problem here is that I can't imagine any version of pornography that won't be founded on extreme female degradation in the world we live in for reasons I stated earlier. Misogyny , human trafficking and child pornography are different yet overlapping issues.
Human trafficking happen for different reasons, among them forced labour. Here we are talking about human trafficking for sexual exploitation. Can you elaborate on whether this change in global human trafficking numbers is also reflected in the area of sex trafficking ? A human depravity issue ?
