There are men that are above this though. It doesn't sound like you have many positive male role models in your life. Men of virtue and self respect. Much of society is sick and degenerate today, that is true. And much of society has been like that for ages, and that is why there are men in the first place who have made the decision to not be that way and decided to live a positive and healthy life. I will not allow you to argue that just because you have decided to rationalize yourself into degeneracy that that then means there's no men of virtue out in the world today.
Let me argue from the non-religious perspective. You are not going to get a wife, and then hit 90 days of nofap. That is a cope. If you get married, you will still be addicted to porn, and maybe even prostitutes. Read the posts of married men here on the forum. They struggle just as much as non-married men. It's putting the cart before the horse. You need to be happy in your life, and not addicted, before being able to have a happy marriage and family. It starts with you. She is not going to make you happy. It can also be the case that if you get married while addicted, you will end up more miserable and addicted then before. You have to understand that you are addicted because of your own decisions. I agree there's nothing wrong with young men having a sex drive and the urge for sex. But it's not a reason to be a degenerate. It all comes down to your choices. Addiction ultimately is a choice. Read the post of guys here on the forum who have very long streaks. They don't make the rationalizations you do about fapping to get away from escorts. They're not so addicted to pmo now and they don't feel so much the urge to fap or to have sex, and it enables them to have healthier relationships with women.
Also, you’re not unique in your addiction, you’re just like many men. It is not uncommon to believe having a partner will cure you and that you are different than all the other addicts that weren’t cured. It is very common, to stop your addictive behaviors in the beginning of a relationship. Very common.
She is right I think, Paulie. You're looking for an external solution to the problems of the choices you're making. In psychology it's called locus of control, and you're looking at the world to control your behaviour. "If I get a wife then I will be okay." When that's just putting the responsibility of your decisions onto someone else, your future to be wife. In that situation you can easily come up with rationalizations why she's wronged you if she's not fulfilling your sexual urges. If she doesn't act the way you want, she's doing you wrong in your mind. That's how external locus of control turns very bad is that you end up hurting others. And the real problem is that you're not taking responsibility for your choices. Watching porn, having sex with escorts, and masturbating is all a choice, one that you do willingly. There are men who choose to control their sexual urges for positive results, and it has nothing to do with having a wife and a family. I don't think there's anything wrong with having desire for sex, but what matters is how you choose to act from that desire. I would suggest reading books about how malevolent people can become when they're controlled by their desire and fear. It doesn't need to be religious. Reading the Gulag Archipelago for me has opened up my understanding about how sick and cruel people can be, and I mean any person including myself. Those desires exist in everyone, and having a comprehensive concept of malevolence makes you aware how your own actions affect others. What did it mean to you that you had sex with those prostitutes? You didn't seem to show any compassion to them. Yes they're making their choice as well, but you decided to further degrade those women. Will you answer yourself in those choices? How do you know you won't have that same lack of compassion towards a wife?
Some thoughts I have here. I've tried the approach to settle for the lesser evil of turning to porn and MB instead of using a prostitute. It's kind of like switching from wine to beer. It's a futile process because more acting out will just lead to more acting out. So far, all we've talked about is behaviors. Fred Stoeker writes that porn and MB are simply symptoms and extensions of uncontrolled eyes and a free-racing mind. I cannot expect to clean up my outside behaviors without dealing with my inside. Trust me. I've tried. It's impossible! The easier approach is (with the help of God) to clean up my inside so that my outside will follow.
yes, that fear is the hardest thing for me to overcome... And i would never do this, if i was married, don't worry. I'm not saying there are no men of virtue, but those men are married probably. If they didn't have any contact with women for a couple of months/years... most of them would probably fall into degenerate sexual behaviour (if they live a normal life. if they live in the woods somewhere with no internet/tv, it's a different thing). Everybody here keeps saying that, but i'm almost 100% sure that's not the case . Seriously, when i fap one time, i won't think about porn for 4 days without problems (let alone prostitutes). And even after 4 days, it's not purely the horniness that gets me, but the loneliness and frustration. I really don't see myself doing this without those three factors at play. I disagree. I think i'm more than good enough to have a wife, if i look at other men that get women all the time... Most men don't go on a 30 year long "journey" to find inner peace and harmony, and become great stable wise men before they have a gf. It's the opposite, i put too much thought and care into everything. If i could drop 50 IQ points, i would get women left right and center. Where are these men? Do you know men that live without any sexual release? Maybe if you're sixty you can do that, but as a twenty year old? That is a fringe group of people, probably less than 0.1% of young men live like that. And i never said i wanted to live like a monk hahah if you want to do that, that's fine. But i don't think it's for me, i've essentially tried for 5 years now. Why would it suddenly work?
Listen guys, I'm not going to stop doing NoFap. All i'm saying is, that i will rather fap than visit the escort site. Once i haven't been on the site for 2-3 months, it's probably going to be way easier to stay off it forever. Up to now i just kind of went on the website and thought "well i can go on the site, as long as i don't fap i don't have to reset the counter". Which led me to go on the site and then obviously i fapped or even worse i visited an actual escort. So by fapping before i go to the site, i don't really lose anything, because i would fap (or worse) anyway when i go on the site. Obviously i still try to fap as little as possible and only do it before i do something worse. I firmly believe, that having a girlfriend will 100% solve THIS problem. There is no doubt in my mind about that. It will actually solve it by definition, if you think about it. Why did i visit prostitutes? Because i was so horny and because i was frustrated that i don't get attention from girls. Why was i horny? because i'm doing nofap. Why am i doing nofap? because i want to get more drive to get a gf. As far as "get your inner life in order before you try to get a wife" goes, i don't believe in that. First of all, I think it's just a massive cope to not face your fears, "well i can just do meditations and read books and learn to love myself, and women will somehow find a way in my life", it's all bs. I've tried this for many years now, it doesn't lead anywhere, it's just an excuse to stay in your comfy living room, instead of going out and facing the massive amount of pain you have to endure to get what you want. Secondly, as i mentioned before, it's not like women are virgins anymore. Most women probably have just as much or more baggage than i have, so i don't feel bad about it. Sure it was a bad thing to visit prostitutes, if i could go back in time i would stop myself from doing it, but also it's kind of the cards i was dealt.
Best of luck mate. I'll be following your story if you keep this journal going. I have had a gf pretty much all of the time since 14, and I still fell into this hole. We are all different, and are all here for different reasons. Have you considered seeing a relationship/dating coach? It might sound a little cringe, but hey, they wouldn't exist if they didn't work. I was always quite shy as a kid, felt like I stood out and was a little "weird", I started to find my groove once I went clubbing and to bars, met some cool mates who were no more attractive than me but got women every night (not that this is a good thing), and I learned how to come out of my shell in that way. It's tough but I find that after knocking back a few beers most blokes are pretty talkative. I owe a lot to 2/3 friends who really helped pull me out of my shell, and they don't even realise it. My messages are always open for you. Good luck on your journey.
Thank you! No I haven't considered seeing a dating coach, i haven't reached those levels of desperation yet When i was younger i was also invited to "go out" with the guys. However, I never understood drinking alcohol, i saw it as poison and it tasted like poison, so i never even considered getting drunk to socialize. I also didn't like the thought of losing control over myself. As a result of that, i was kind of alienated at these evenings. Everyone was laughing about dumb shit and i was just sitting there, having a terrible time. I geniunely didn't enjoy it, so after a couple of times i just declined every invitation and instead sat at home playing video games on friday/saturday night and then i stopped getting invited after some time, which is understandable. It's sad that drinking or doing drugs is basically the only way to meet women (unless you are a super extroverted gigachad), but had i known back then that refusing alcohol would lead to me having no social life at all, i would have definitely done it. In my mind it was always a good thing to not drink, it didn't even occur to me, that this would be such a bad decision (probably the worst i've ever made). But yeah... doesn't help to cry about it now, that ship has sailed.
Where are these men? Me! And many other guys on this forum. You're so addicted you don't even see it. I'm nearly 2 months free of pmo and I feel better than I have in a long time. And 2 months is pretty short compared to a lot of other guys streaks. Yes this is without a wife or girlfriend. I'm also a virgin that's never had real sex. You're so addicted by pleasure it disgusts me, and you're degrading other men who are putting in actual effort, and you're rationalizing that since YOU can't do it then it's impossible. No. You're just weak! And nobody said anything about going hermit mode forever. Just go 3 months of nofap. If you can't do that, then a wife will not be able to do anything for you because you can't control your sexual urges. A man can control his sex drive. Mine is pretty strong as well and it's lead to many relapses for me. The difference is that I and other guys here want to get over this addiction completely, whereas you won't even acknowledge our existence saying what we are doing is impossible. Get help with your addiction if you can't deal with it on your own.
And you've never read the super saiyan challenge thread have you? Either that or you act like we literally don't exist.
@Paulie G. hey, you are in denial. I was also in denial and still am probably to a certain degree. porn use has taught us many lies that we need to resolve to be able to escape 1. It is healthy to masturbate 2. It is normal to watch porn 3. Watching porn due to boredom, stress, anxiety, depression etc. is not a sign of severe addiction 4. It is impossible to survive without ejaculation 5. Surviving without ejaculation means you are not a real man 6. The world is bad so I may as well resort to porn because I have no control it is important that you identify all the lies that the addiction has taught you and then you will start to heal
Also… no ship has sailed… if you end your addiction, you will find a healthy relationship. When I was first coming out of my addiction I was attracting damaged women. I am fully confident that when I am healed, I will attract healthy women.
Thank you for the high school nostalgia, it's been a very long time since I ever tuned into Suicide and Happiness.
Thanks, interesting read. hm this is interesting. Regarding 1., i don't actually know if it's unhealthy to never ejaculate. I've heard that it can lead to prostate cancer, but that might very well be bs. 2. it's a sick thing to watch porn, but it is "normal" in the sense that it is the norm nowadays. But that obvioulsy doesn't mean it's a good thing. Number 5 i don't believe in, but rather "Not being able to find a woman means you are not a real man.". If you are unable to reproduce, you have failed as a life form by definition. I think i subconsciously believe 4 and 6, so thanks for pointing that out. I hope you are right, my friend, but .... as you can read in this thread, i really don't think my problem is excessive masturbation or porn use. I don't see how i would attract women once i stop masturbating. Are they going to magically come up to me in the supermarket? i don't think so. I have to somehow put myself in social situations, but i have no idea how...
I'll give a little update of my situtation: I'm on day 6, which is my longest streak since at least a couple of months, so i guess the motivation you guys gave me worked Thanks for that. I had strong urges on days 4&5. To my shame i have to admit, i even peaked at the escort site again even though i promised myself to never do that again. The weekend is always hard for me, because there is so much time and i usually don't know what to do and end up doing something dumb. But luckily i made it through this weekend without fapping or watching porn. I think it would be great to leave the house more often, especially on the weekend, but i just don't know what to do... I wish i had a group of guys like back in the school days, where we could just hang out somewhere and talk shit. But everyone moved and we aren't in the same area anymore and then things just fizzled out.
